Episode 13: Reframing Talk Therapy with Psychedelics
In Episode 13, Natalie and Chelsea sit down with Allie Runkle, a Psychodynamic Therapist specializing in Ketamine Assisted Therapy, to talk about her background and practice, the resurgence of Psychedelic Assisted Therapy, and its application to treat PTSD and/or other mood disorders. In this episode, you will hear how medical professionals like Allie are using ketamine or other psychedelics to reframe “traditional therapy,” who can benefit from psychedelic therapy, how they work and are changing the way people think about and experience therapy.
Stay tuned - we’ll be back with an all new episode for you on 12/15!
Show Notes:
Hosts:
Natalie M.
Chelsea M.
Timestamps:
**00:00** - Introduction
**05:03** - Natalie ask’s Allie to tell us about her background, education, credentials, and how she got into ketamine assisted therapy.
**18:17** - Allie discusses her personal experience with ketamine assisted therapy.
**24:00** - Allie discusses taking care of herself and having integrity within her profession so that she can help others and hold space for them.
**28:46** - Allie starts to go into detail on what ketamine assisted therapy requires.
**31:25** - Allie describes the importance of “set & setting” during ketamine assisted therapy.
**34:57** - Allie describes how ketamine is administered for therapy.
**37:37** - Natalie asks Allie how someone qualifies for ketamine assisted therapy and how many sessions one typically needs to go through.
**45:46** - Chelsea asks Allie what the post-Ketamine assisted therapy session protocol is.
**47:06** - Break
**47:28** - Natalie asks Allie to explain what “neuroplasticity” is.
**55:51** - Natalie asks Allie who would be a good candidate for ketamine assisted therapy.
**59:58** - Allie talks about “integration” and that this is where the reframe of this therapy really comes into play.
**1:05:44** - Natalie asks Allie specifically about what happens if a person's problem is that they dissociate, how does Ketamine therapy help them.
**1:07:45** - Chelsea kicks off a conversation with Allie around the perception that using assistance (ketamine or otherwise) to achieve healing in therapy is like taking some sort of short cut.
**1:15:27** - Natalie kicks off a conversation with Allie around Psilocybin and MDMA, how they’re different/similar to Ketamine and if they’re on the same trajectory as Ketamine for therapy.
**1:28:44** - Allie discusses trying to make her practice accessible to clients from a wide range of financial backgrounds.
**1:15:** - End of Episode
**1:37:24** - Stay Tuned
**1:38:19** - Outro
Key Takeaways:
1. “Fixed Mindset”: Belief that abilities, talents, and traits are fixed or inherent and cannot be significantly changed.
Example: Avoiding challenges for fear of failure.
2. “Growth Mindset”: Belief that abilities, talents, and traits can be developed and improved through effort and learning.
Example: Embracing challenges as opportunities to grow.
3. **Tips for Cultivating a Growth Mindset**
Self-Awareness
Identify Your Fixed Mindset Triggers: Recognize the situations that trigger a fixed mindset (e.g., challenges, setbacks, or criticism).
Reflect: Make it a habit to reflect on your thoughts and feelings regularly, identifying instances where a fixed mindset held you back.
Change Your Language
Switch Your Language: Instead of saying “I can’t do this” or “I’ll never . . .,” say “I can’t do this yet,” or “I am moving towards . . . .”
Embrace Constructive Feedback: When you or others fail, #fail forward by focusing on what can be learned from the experience.
Reframe Challenges and Setbacks
Stretch Goals: Set an objective that pushes you out of your comfort zone.
Reframe Failures: View setbacks as opportunities for growth, not as a validation of an inability or shortcoming.
Embrace Feedback and Prioritize Learning Over Validation
Constructive Criticism: Actively seek out feedback that helps you improve or refine your skills.
Encourage Open Dialogue: Create an environment or cultivate relationships where open and constructive feedback is welcomed and regular.
Value the Process: Prioritize learning and improving over success or perfection.
Focus on Yourself: Prioritize yourself, focus on your personal development, and celebrate your achievements. Avoid seeking approval or validation from others.
Additional Resources:
@allierunkeltherapycove on IG
Connect with Us:
- TikTok
- Threads
---
Thank you for tuning in!